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P600 DTG and DTF together in love?


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Hi everybody! I have read so much now and am a total DIY kinda guy. I have gone back and forth regarding the merits of DTG vs DTF. I think there are great things about both!

I have a P600 that is currently unmodified.... 

Here is what I'm thinking of doing:

Put together a full DTG conversion kit for the P600 and also buy all the supplies for doing DTF as well. (inks, extra cartridges, film etc.)

When I want to do DTG, I load the DTG ink and run through a standard DTG workflow.

When I need to do DTF, I switch the inks out and run with that workflow. 

I suppose that by doing this I would lose the ability to run a DTF roll of film. Other than the process of switching inks, doesn't seem to be too many downsides that I can think of.

Any major pitfalls that you guys see here? 

Also, any recommendation on a RIP that would cover both DTF and DTG? 

Thanks!

Cameron

 



 

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53 minutes ago, Cameronhjensen said:

Hi everybody! I have read so much now and am a total DIY kinda guy. I have gone back and forth regarding the merits of DTG vs DTF. I think there are great things about both!

I have a P600 that is currently unmodified.... 

Here is what I'm thinking of doing:

Put together a full DTG conversion kit for the P600 and also buy all the supplies for doing DTF as well. (inks, extra cartridges, film etc.)

When I want to do DTG, I load the DTG ink and run through a standard DTG workflow.

When I need to do DTF, I switch the inks out and run with that workflow. 

I suppose that by doing this I would lose the ability to run a DTF roll of film. Other than the process of switching inks, doesn't seem to be too many downsides that I can think of.

Any major pitfalls that you guys see here? 

Also, any recommendation on a RIP that would cover both DTF and DTG? 

Thanks!

Cameron

 



 

I see some big issues with the idea. 

The biggest issue, The ink. You have an entire ink system on the P600, which takes roughly 800ML of flushing solution to remove each ink color. It would take hours, put a huge strain on your ink system, and you'll end up replacing parts much sooner than needed- not to mention the very large amount of wasted ink. 

The solution: Use Kodak DTG ink( I've read it works on DTF film), AND/OR DTG ink compatible film for other inks. 

 

2nd, I'm not going to lie in any way here. Sheet printing SUCKS for DTF. Really does. Very time consuming, accident prone, and overall bad for time/cost savings. With sheets, you'll need a curing oven with a vent, The act of curing the film/ink/powder, the fumes are harmful. Just as well, The powder dust is harmful. IF you are only doing a couple a day, or maybe 10-20 a week, it should work out fine. but in mass, or printing more often, not really so. 

So if you see people flapping a printed film around in the air from a clear tote or something, and sticking it into a regular toaster oven, you are causing great harm to yourself if you are doing this in any type of mass, as well as a huge loss of time( and eventual mess, its as fine as dust), considering both things are very bad to breathe in. 

In general, unless it's very small amount of prints, Roll printing is the way DTF was meant to be used. A venting system, ( or fume extractor) is very necessary. I read one about one guys story having a lung/chest infection for months before realizing it was the powder doing it manually ( in mass). I believe him, Because I have trouble with it sometimes too when I was pouring powder all the time- not realizing what it was until I shut the business down for a few months. 

 

Now for the actual comparison for DTG and DTF. Me and my partner have sold over 25,000 DTG printed products in the last 5 years. This year, we sold over 3500 DTF prints. Turns out, DTF has held better in the wash, ( much better), colors are more vibrant, no pretreatment EVERYWHERE, ( and those mishaps from pretreatment). I had a woman contact me from a 2 year old order, and the DTG print had completely disintegrated over 104 washes ( once a week for 2 years).  I have had previous customers(DTG) PRAISE me for the new method after wearing them for a few months and still looking brand new.

To top that off, DTF will practically transfer to anything, the ink cost is MUCH MUCH less, Factor in total cost( powder/ink/film etc), It's still less than half for me per print compared to DTG. The maintenance is MUCH easier as well- as a MUCH less involved conversion. 

So in my opinion, DTG is dead, or will be once people find the right products to use. I've used various inks, powders, etc from various places. Wasted a ton of money. Overall, The DTFsuperstore ink and powder have worked FANTASTIC for me( ink/powder/ film quality and your ink settings determine final product quality). with my own diligence to achieve quality, my prints come out softer than DTG now( with the exception of black only prints), not plastic like at all, and are matte. Literally, I have 6 DTG machines in storage now, which will be parted out at some point.

 

So if your goal is to DTG print, and randomly DTF print, just get the DTG ink compatible DTF sheets- problem solved. If your looking to make and sell a product as a business efficiently and cost effective, I highly recommend DTF, or at least a system than can handle both accordingly. 

Edited by johnson4
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I really appreciate the thoughtful response.... 

My production would be 10-20/week with an occasional spike a couple times a year. 

I do have some really great air filtration as I run laser cutting 3d printers and a CNC machine in the shop as well.

Maybe I need to just focus on DTF as I like the idea of ultimately doing a roll to roll setup, but I will have to do it in phases so will be doing the powder work by hand initially while I figure out either a DIY or off the shelf machine. 

This does somewhat simplify things for me..... 

 

 

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26 minutes ago, Cameronhjensen said:

I really appreciate the thoughtful response.... 

My production would be 10-20/week with an occasional spike a couple times a year. 

I do have some really great air filtration as I run laser cutting 3d printers and a CNC machine in the shop as well.

Maybe I need to just focus on DTF as I like the idea of ultimately doing a roll to roll setup, but I will have to do it in phases so will be doing the powder work by hand initially while I figure out either a DIY or off the shelf machine. 

This does somewhat simplify things for me..... 

 

 

Im glad it helps. A DIY build is pretty easy if you have spare junk around. I made one out of a $50 harbor freight cart, an old broken heat press, and a p400 printer. 
 

 

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I still disagree on you about dtg being dead. Dtf is not same as dtg. I would never use a dtf t shirt. I would rather buy a t shirt each year rather than wearing dtf printer shirts. 

Most likely your t shirt gets old even if your print looks New after a year. So i dont see a point on lasting longer. It's only advantage to me, if you use automatic system it is easier to work for bulk orders and you can transfer it on polyester.

With enough money you can produce as many as dtf machines(if you print on roll fabric.). But yeah its machine would be expensive and you would need a small factory.

In the end dtf is for people that dont want to invest much money and have work over 50 shirts Per day, and prefer to work alone or with a small group.

 

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